[LinuxBIOS] Distribution of binary images and Intel NDAs...

[Marcelo Coelho]

Hi!

First of all I'd like to congratulate all of you for your excellent work!

I've seen the LinuxBios presentation and I'd like to know if there is
a technical reason that would prevent the creation and distribution of
binary BIOS files, ready to be flashed onto the motherboard's BIOS.

If that could be done, then the possibility of a developer signing a
NDA with Intel to develop a BIOS for it could be done, right?

I know that NDAs aren't the way for better software, but at least it
allows that a piece of software exists... :S

Thanks for your enlightenment!
Marcelo

[Reece R. Pollack]

On Wed, March 21, 2007 7:14 am, Marcelo Coelho said:
> I've seen the LinuxBios presentation and I'd like to know if there is
> a technical reason that would prevent the creation and distribution of
> binary BIOS files, ready to be flashed onto the motherboard's BIOS.
>
> If that could be done, then the possibility of a developer signing a
> NDA with Intel to develop a BIOS for it could be done, right?

LinuxBIOS code is licensed under the GPL, which requires the source code
to be made available on request. That prevents binary-only distributions.
Besides, what's the benefit of a binary-only LinuxBIOS over a binary-only
PhoenixBIOS?

That said, it may be possible to write GPL'd source code based on
documents provided under NDA. It all depends on the specific terms of the
NDA. There is no such thing as a "standard" NDA.

[Marcelo Coelho]

> LinuxBIOS code is licensed under the GPL, which requires the source code
> to be made available on request. That prevents binary-only distributions.
> Besides, what's the benefit of a binary-only LinuxBIOS over a binary-only
> PhoenixBIOS?

I'm not saying binary-only, just asking if it would be possible to
_ALSO_ have a binary format available. I haven't tested LinuxBios
because the HW that I have isn't compatible, but I believe that the
most difficult part is the creation of those binary images.
> That said, it may be possible to write GPL'd source code based on
> documents provided under NDA. It all depends on the specific terms of the
> NDA. There is no such thing as a "standard" NDA.

I agree, but I thought that NDA is pratically anti-GPL.

Thanks for your time!

[Stefan Reinauer]

* Marcelo Coelho  [070321 12:14]:
> I've seen the LinuxBios presentation and I'd like to know if there is
> a technical reason that would prevent the creation and distribution of
> binary BIOS files, ready to be flashed onto the motherboard's BIOS.

There is such a distribution of binary files already:

http://qa.linuxbios.org/overview.php

One reason against it is that you want to make sure the images work on
your system. Therefore we added the LinuxBIOS test system:

http://www.linuxbios.org/Distributed_and_Automated_Testsystem

You can get a list of tested mainboards here:

http://qa.linuxbios.org/overview.php?tested=1

note how many boards are tested at the moment ;-) so, please everyone
who can add a board to the test system, please do so. This helps
increase the quality of LinuxBIOS a lot.

Mainboard vendors: If you wish to have your boards tested in the
LinuxBIOS test system, please contact me. coresystems offers to set up
the test system for you, or to host it for you, depending on your needs.
> If that could be done, then the possibility of a developer signing a
> NDA with Intel to develop a BIOS for it could be done, right?

That's a completely different story. Sure you can almost always
distribute a binary ONLY bios. But this would completely miss the point
of LinuxBIOS and drop one of its major advantages. You already get a
closed source bios with most boards.
> I know that NDAs aren't the way for better software, but at least it
> allows that a piece of software exists... :S

NDAs are not too big a problem (for companies). Most hardware vendors
require an NDA for their data sheets. coresystems maintains NDAs with
about a dozen hardware vendors for that reason. Most companies are very
open to see you release the code under GPL even though it is created
from the NDAed data sheets, as it gives them a large competitive
advantage.

Best regards,

Stefan

[Marcelo Coelho]

> There is such a distribution of binary files already:
>
> http://qa.linuxbios.org/overview.php
> http://www.linuxbios.org/Distributed_and_Automated_Testsystem
> http://qa.linuxbios.org/overview.php?tested=1

Well, the Linuxbios site is getting big! Missed those pages....
> NDAs are not too big a problem (for companies). Most hardware vendors
> require an NDA for their data sheets. coresystems maintains NDAs with
> about a dozen hardware vendors for that reason. Most companies are very
> open to see you release the code under GPL even though it is created
> from the NDAed data sheets, as it gives them a large competitive
> advantage.

Thanks for clearing that up. If AMD doesn't release a platform
compatible with what I'm lokking for, maybe i'll do a NDA with Intel
for the latest CPUs in the next months.

Best regards!

[Uwe Hermann]

On Wed, Mar 21, 2007 at 11:36:22AM +0000, Marcelo Coelho wrote:
> > LinuxBIOS code is licensed under the GPL, which requires the source code
> > to be made available on request. That prevents binary-only distributions.
> > Besides, what's the benefit of a binary-only LinuxBIOS over a binary-only
> > PhoenixBIOS?
>
> I'm not saying binary-only, just asking if it would be possible to
> _ALSO_ have a binary format available. I haven't tested LinuxBios
> because the HW that I have isn't compatible, but I believe that the
> most difficult part is the creation of those binary images.

If you just want to try out LinuxBIOS you can use QEMU:
http://linuxbios.org/QEMU_Build_Tutorial

HTH, Uwe.