Re: [coreboot] Disabling Intel ME 11 via undocumented mode
I can't download the .pdf file for some reason (maybe the tla's got to it?) http://fm.csl.sri.com/LAW/2009/dobry-law09-HAP-Challenges.pdf can someone send it to me? Thanks Thoughts: Sad this is still not an actual method of disablement, but it doesn't really matter as anyone who buys *new* x86 hardware is still supporting wintel's development of newer and better anti-features, DRM and surveillance technology - one that can't even be me-cleaner/hap/etc nerfed will be released some day. I wish people spent their energy popularizing owner controlled arches instead of beating a dead horse. While IBM also makes surveillance tech they make POWER which as the last performance owner controlled arch that sells for attainable prices goes a long way to offset that. Heres to hoping IBM starts selling POWER workstations... I find it hard to believe that the NSA uses made in china intel stuff with ME chips present for their high security stuff (hap nerfed or not), I imagine top secret things are done on POWER (which has a USA cpu fab and no black boxes).
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 08/29/2017 11:00 PM, Taiidan@gmx.com wrote:
I can't download the .pdf file for some reason (maybe the tla's got to it?) http://fm.csl.sri.com/LAW/2009/dobry-law09-HAP-Challenges.pdf can someone send it to me? Thanks
Thoughts: Sad this is still not an actual method of disablement, but it doesn't really matter as anyone who buys *new* x86 hardware is still supporting wintel's development of newer and better anti-features, DRM and surveillance technology - one that can't even be me-cleaner/hap/etc nerfed will be released some day. I wish people spent their energy popularizing owner controlled arches instead of beating a dead horse.
While IBM also makes surveillance tech they make POWER which as the last performance owner controlled arch that sells for attainable prices goes a long way to offset that. Heres to hoping IBM starts selling POWER workstations...
POWER9 workstations are already coming on the market: https://raptorcs.com/TALOSII/ Note that IBM selling similar machines directly would likely be more expensive, not less, based on POWER8 price comparisons between IBM and other vendors. People purchase IBM branded products for extreme reliability, not to get cheap equipment...
I find it hard to believe that the NSA uses made in china intel stuff with ME chips present for their high security stuff (hap nerfed or not), I imagine top secret things are done on POWER (which has a USA cpu fab and no black boxes).
- -- Timothy Pearson Raptor Engineering +1 (415) 727-8645 (direct line) +1 (512) 690-0200 (switchboard) https://www.raptorengineering.com -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJZpxHDAAoJEK+E3vEXDOFbTGAH/2U1dDPoJiCIomYsD0RFox9F O9voeIPARbsbobv6Yvl/VmAI40D81w5u/7vdk6mO//zFJXpeEpLTgytBqZlDORRV CfnTG/etE/i8ShGgcvWCf6uqEiVdko4ng+gwh5oeQJ/WFdGlVFmeZbQ+WUwWSbr0 v6icL1SHD3EuCdNbMZimV7tcdglDEULzPHVEHSkhdMGtldWHyBvTuvp6rGAO47O4 lMM5SDXFa9S+ookTuSdLV6F3v4s4GLsmqkyPfNEWdh4iXqA72sZWAsYeyrBBn4fR dp92uQuqgdeDr6r28YAAA8mkHD/7jbzDcDnmGiMqVyKU0ugDIlqGTvg3OsPiY24= =C5ac -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
On 08/30/2017 03:28 PM, Timothy Pearson wrote:
POWER9 workstations are already coming on the market:
Note that IBM selling similar machines directly would likely be more expensive, not less, based on POWER8 price comparisons between IBM and other vendors. People purchase IBM branded products for extreme reliability, not to get cheap equipment... Damn that is sick as hell! you guys actually pulled it off! how did you get the funding? how have I not heard about this before?
On Wed, 30 Aug 2017 18:09:51 -0400 "Taiidan@gmx.com" <Taiidan@gmx.com> wrote:
On 08/30/2017 03:28 PM, Timothy Pearson wrote:
POWER9 workstations are already coming on the market:
Note that IBM selling similar machines directly would likely be more expensive, not less, based on POWER8 price comparisons between IBM and other vendors. People purchase IBM branded products for extreme reliability, not to get cheap equipment... Damn that is sick as hell! you guys actually pulled it off! how did you get the funding? how have I not heard about this before?
Yeah, I wonder why it was not announced on this list. Although not directly coreboot related, there probably is strong interest here within this community. There is also a channel on freenode: #talos-workstation
From what I've heard, pre-orders will close very soon, and it's unknown if there will be a second production run of the boards...
Timothy, maybe you could shed some light on it? Cheers, Merlin
-- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://mail.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
-- Merlin Büge <toni@bluenox07.de>
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 08/31/2017 03:23 AM, Merlin Büge wrote:
On Wed, 30 Aug 2017 18:09:51 -0400 "Taiidan@gmx.com" <Taiidan@gmx.com> wrote:
On 08/30/2017 03:28 PM, Timothy Pearson wrote:
POWER9 workstations are already coming on the market:
Note that IBM selling similar machines directly would likely be more expensive, not less, based on POWER8 price comparisons between IBM and other vendors. People purchase IBM branded products for extreme reliability, not to get cheap equipment... Damn that is sick as hell! you guys actually pulled it off! how did you get the funding? how have I not heard about this before?
Yeah, I wonder why it was not announced on this list. Although not directly coreboot related, there probably is strong interest here within this community.
There is also a channel on freenode: #talos-workstation
From what I've heard, pre-orders will close very soon, and it's unknown if there will be a second production run of the boards...
Timothy, maybe you could shed some light on it?
Cheers,
Merlin
Well, I didn't want to spam the list; that was the main reason for the lack of a separate announcement here. OpenPOWER systems don't have a good reason to use coreboot versus the already open hostboot, and now with DDR4 in use on the POWER9 a coreboot port is going to be even harder than it would have been on POWER8. That being said, since there does appear to be interest, I'll mention that the Talos™ II pre-order system is largely driven by the fact that the POWER9 CPU has not yet been officially released. Raptor Computing Systems is the first vendor on the market and the only vendor to be shipping systems along with the first POWER9 CPUs scheduled for Q4 this year. Additionally, the Talos™ II retains unique features not found on any other OpenPOWER machine, including the ability to self-host critical programmable logic components. Cost is far less than Talos I largely due to a higher level of integration on the POWER9 CPU. TDPs are far less than POWER8 (90W for the bundled CPU) and we are confident that this machine is a worthy replacement for x86 workstation systems that are not locked to proprietary software. There's an FAQ page here which also goes into more detail: https://raptorcs.com/content/base/faq.html On our current schedule preorders for shipment this year close the middle of next month, so if you'd like to be among the first to have a Talos™ II please get your pre-order in ASAP! - -- Timothy Pearson Raptor Engineering +1 (415) 727-8645 (direct line) +1 (512) 690-0200 (switchboard) https://www.raptorengineering.com -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJZqFBjAAoJEK+E3vEXDOFbkwoH/A/deLI5G1pFQBSRGCLkkg3p rHKJ5WWeyCVQW0rdVkYbjhNuRFIyKR4a9+DLGjopfTJHc5wow0n86vdiZLd3gsGm msReXsOpsEJeQC9PbscR/NkhPT1wjuCYB5au98NHd+9zKu/qYx64GPmfWlbDZh6r 49F8JEynoZcs6UJhGt3O5/qInnaaGP9WrKlb/oM6X8NvYFYr7WNBhYWQWYwPEtxv L5hOs66L5UYinjG09F2xZiwzG1RhwdRC7V2zwO1xBDEcue7t41lF9M7sHESH3zCB oN7uvoUHGW4CsH2IIDFcZOzceb6U3dEy7yOrxdcFvJcXNd0aDGHypzd5q1QaNZk= =CfuF -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 Timothy, I think that you should heavily promote the TALOS on the coreboot list and also ask to have it promoted on the vendors page on coreboot.org. The kind of people that want the hardware you sell are here in the coreboot community in large numbers. Of course, this is assuming that the leadership in coreboot would permit you to promote it here. While not technically coreboot, it is indeed libre hardware that you are selling, and does come with free boot firmware similar to coreboot. For this reason, I personally (with approval from other members of the project) added you to libreboot.org aswell; see: https://libreboot.org/suppliers.html#raptor-engineering https://libreboot.org/news/talos.html It's very important for the sake of the free software movement that your TALOS II effort succeeds and thrives. On 31/08/17 19:07, Timothy Pearson wrote:
On 08/31/2017 03:23 AM, Merlin Büge wrote:
On Wed, 30 Aug 2017 18:09:51 -0400 "Taiidan@gmx.com" <Taiidan@gmx.com> wrote:
On 08/30/2017 03:28 PM, Timothy Pearson wrote:
POWER9 workstations are already coming on the market:
Note that IBM selling similar machines directly would likely be more expensive, not less, based on POWER8 price comparisons between IBM and other vendors. People purchase IBM branded products for extreme reliability, not to get cheap equipment... Damn that is sick as hell! you guys actually pulled it off! how did you get the funding? how have I not heard about this before?
Yeah, I wonder why it was not announced on this list. Although not directly coreboot related, there probably is strong interest here within this community.
There is also a channel on freenode: #talos-workstation
From what I've heard, pre-orders will close very soon, and it's unknown if there will be a second production run of the boards...
Timothy, maybe you could shed some light on it?
Cheers,
Merlin
Well, I didn't want to spam the list; that was the main reason for the lack of a separate announcement here. OpenPOWER systems don't have a good reason to use coreboot versus the already open hostboot, and now with DDR4 in use on the POWER9 a coreboot port is going to be even harder than it would have been on POWER8.
That being said, since there does appear to be interest, I'll mention that the Talos™ II pre-order system is largely driven by the fact that the POWER9 CPU has not yet been officially released. Raptor Computing Systems is the first vendor on the market and the only vendor to be shipping systems along with the first POWER9 CPUs scheduled for Q4 this year. Additionally, the Talos™ II retains unique features not found on any other OpenPOWER machine, including the ability to self-host critical programmable logic components.
Cost is far less than Talos I largely due to a higher level of integration on the POWER9 CPU. TDPs are far less than POWER8 (90W for the bundled CPU) and we are confident that this machine is a worthy replacement for x86 workstation systems that are not locked to proprietary software.
There's an FAQ page here which also goes into more detail:
https://raptorcs.com/content/base/faq.html
On our current schedule preorders for shipment this year close the middle of next month, so if you'd like to be among the first to have a Talos™ II please get your pre-order in ASAP!
- -- Leah Rowe Libreboot developer and project founder. Use free software. Free as in freedom. https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html Use a free BIOS - https://libreboot.org/ Use a free operating system, GNU+Linux. Support computer user freedom https://fsf.org/ - https://gnu.org/ Minifree Ltd, trading as Ministry of Freedom | Registered in England, No. 9361826 | VAT No. GB202190462 Registered Office: 19 Hilton Road, Canvey Island, Essex SS8 9QA, UK | Web: https://minifree.org/ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEE+JRrnG26iGmvPhSA/0W3TPnRz5QFAlmpxEIACgkQ/0W3TPnR z5TIjAf/X3H1J1vvZPGWSoLXahREbnOqKNHeTPt0uHFBTKni+Eb8c+3MLBTWcWRj D6KR4uKQ16l3ALQb7BxN98RFWwQpAtSNGzeDuJcIrNRp8r+T01bZF8c8bMZq2p0u yMQSHWJmAJ6LlGOV4F2VwRYcLkBA0yi8SthizUzLWcHnaqxLLRZwc4QQLkssi5X1 6QvI2+EPqjQQ9xMiJEPNxATYQknC1Vw82WSlsjUGes6vU4C3BtnKTz8oEIAtujIs OHXLmG3T+DchR6WLX1Tj5DVz2bWQ5b0ljoxL25Ex/D2faCULsbVXES+d85VOZTxy gsT8uQdx7BO+OwppFVwPughnaLovFA== =JAlG -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Timothy, Ubuntu Server is officially supporting Power8 ( https://www.ubuntu.com/ download/server/power8 ). Do you have insight if they will support Power9? Can we get a complete overview of all the I/O ports with Make and Model#. I see what looks like 4 SATA ports (in 2 different colors) on the board ( https://static.rptorcs.com/TL2B01/images/boardsmall.png ), but they are missing in the documentation ( https://raptorcs.com/ content/TL2B01/intro.html ). I would also like to know what make & model the SATA controller is and the model of the Broadcom NIC chip for example. Else keep up the good work. Thanks. On Fri, Sep 1, 2017 at 4:34 PM, Leah Rowe <info@gluglug.org.uk> wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256
Timothy, I think that you should heavily promote the TALOS on the coreboot list and also ask to have it promoted on the vendors page on coreboot.org. The kind of people that want the hardware you sell are here in the coreboot community in large numbers. Of course, this is assuming that the leadership in coreboot would permit you to promote it here.
While not technically coreboot, it is indeed libre hardware that you are selling, and does come with free boot firmware similar to coreboot.
For this reason, I personally (with approval from other members of the project) added you to libreboot.org aswell; see:
https://libreboot.org/suppliers.html#raptor-engineering https://libreboot.org/news/talos.html
It's very important for the sake of the free software movement that your TALOS II effort succeeds and thrives.
On 31/08/17 19:07, Timothy Pearson wrote:
On 08/31/2017 03:23 AM, Merlin Büge wrote:
On Wed, 30 Aug 2017 18:09:51 -0400 "Taiidan@gmx.com" <Taiidan@gmx.com> wrote:
On 08/30/2017 03:28 PM, Timothy Pearson wrote:
POWER9 workstations are already coming on the market:
Note that IBM selling similar machines directly would likely be more expensive, not less, based on POWER8 price comparisons between IBM and other vendors. People purchase IBM branded products for extreme reliability, not to get cheap equipment... Damn that is sick as hell! you guys actually pulled it off! how did you get the funding? how have I not heard about this before?
Yeah, I wonder why it was not announced on this list. Although not directly coreboot related, there probably is strong interest here within this community.
There is also a channel on freenode: #talos-workstation
From what I've heard, pre-orders will close very soon, and it's unknown if there will be a second production run of the boards...
Timothy, maybe you could shed some light on it?
Cheers,
Merlin
Well, I didn't want to spam the list; that was the main reason for the lack of a separate announcement here. OpenPOWER systems don't have a good reason to use coreboot versus the already open hostboot, and now with DDR4 in use on the POWER9 a coreboot port is going to be even harder than it would have been on POWER8.
That being said, since there does appear to be interest, I'll mention that the Talos™ II pre-order system is largely driven by the fact that the POWER9 CPU has not yet been officially released. Raptor Computing Systems is the first vendor on the market and the only vendor to be shipping systems along with the first POWER9 CPUs scheduled for Q4 this year. Additionally, the Talos™ II retains unique features not found on any other OpenPOWER machine, including the ability to self-host critical programmable logic components.
Cost is far less than Talos I largely due to a higher level of integration on the POWER9 CPU. TDPs are far less than POWER8 (90W for the bundled CPU) and we are confident that this machine is a worthy replacement for x86 workstation systems that are not locked to proprietary software.
There's an FAQ page here which also goes into more detail:
https://raptorcs.com/content/base/faq.html
On our current schedule preorders for shipment this year close the middle of next month, so if you'd like to be among the first to have a Talos™ II please get your pre-order in ASAP!
- -- Leah Rowe
Libreboot developer and project founder.
Use free software. Free as in freedom. https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html
Use a free BIOS - https://libreboot.org/ Use a free operating system, GNU+Linux.
Support computer user freedom https://fsf.org/ - https://gnu.org/
Minifree Ltd, trading as Ministry of Freedom | Registered in England, No. 9361826 | VAT No. GB202190462 Registered Office: 19 Hilton Road, Canvey Island, Essex SS8 9QA, UK | Web: https://minifree.org/
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-- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://mail.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
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Try this backup copy from the Internet Archive: https://web.archive.org/web/20121211162830/fm.csl.sri.com/LAW/2009/dobry-law... 2017-08-30 1:00 GMT-03:00 Taiidan@gmx.com <Taiidan@gmx.com>:
I can't download the .pdf file for some reason (maybe the tla's got to it?) http://fm.csl.sri.com/LAW/2009/dobry-law09-HAP-Challenges.pdf can someone send it to me? Thanks
Thoughts: Sad this is still not an actual method of disablement, but it doesn't really matter as anyone who buys *new* x86 hardware is still supporting wintel's development of newer and better anti-features, DRM and surveillance technology - one that can't even be me-cleaner/hap/etc nerfed will be released some day. I wish people spent their energy popularizing owner controlled arches instead of beating a dead horse.
While IBM also makes surveillance tech they make POWER which as the last performance owner controlled arch that sells for attainable prices goes a long way to offset that. Heres to hoping IBM starts selling POWER workstations...
I find it hard to believe that the NSA uses made in china intel stuff with ME chips present for their high security stuff (hap nerfed or not), I imagine top secret things are done on POWER (which has a USA cpu fab and no black boxes).
-- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://mail.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
participants (6)
-
Felipe Sanches -
Leah Rowe -
Merlin Büge -
Rene Shuster -
Taiidan＠gmx.com -
Timothy Pearson